Taking Equipment from Cops:

policemanSome of my readers (and readers I see at other Conservative blogs)  are rather anti-cop;  too anti-cop for my taste and for the safety of our communities, in my opinion.  Obviously, I get it when you’re pushed around by one, or see the horrible killings that have been happening lately…a lot more than usual, which gets me thinking… but I digress……..

Whether you’re anti-cop or not, what do you think of THIS?  I found it amazing and am hoping venues other than FOX are getting this news out, particularly now that terrorism is an even bigger threat than ever.

Looking forward to your input!

Z

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46 Responses to Taking Equipment from Cops:

  1. jerrydablade says:

    I grew up as the son of a cop in one of the most violent cities in America. Now we’ve come to this? Terrorists are streaming over our wide open border and we want to disarm the police? I stand with the police.

  2. bocopro says:

    Any large organization is bound to have its share of renegades, ne’er-do-wells, racists, bums, petty thieves, and even psychos. That includes EPA, IRS, the military, various police organizations, and even the Boy Scouts.

    From time to time people are gonna mess up, make bad decisions, become convinced they’re John Wayne, or play Rambo. All we can hope for is that those percentages remain small and the damaged is limited to property only.

    IOW, most people tend to do the right things most of the time, and considering the vast numbers of city, county, state, and federal cops authorized to carry/use firearms and the threats and stress they encounter daily, I’m surprised that MORE suicide-by-cop shootings don’t happen.

    In general, I believe that the LEOs should be armed at least as well as the gang-bangers and assorted creeps. But I’m not at all comfortable with small-town PDs or rural sheriff departments having heavy weapons such as tanks and sophisticated surveillance equipment.

    SWAT, yes. By all means. Give ’em the latest gear and train ’em how to use it. Then when a situation gets out of the control of a small-town PD or Sheriff, call ’em in. Put SWAT trainees through comprehensive psych evals before assignment to the teams and periodically to see if they’re going off the deep end.

    Not sure I want Bubba and Jethro having access to full-auto ARs or armored assault vehicles or sonic/infrared scanners, tho. TASERS, O.K. Pepper spray, O.K. Sidearms, O.K. Radios, cameras, shotguns in the trunk, gas masks, sure. But special-forces stuff only for the special forces LEOs.

  3. I’m not anti-cop per se, but that video just released by Rahm Emanuel has really given me pause. WTH?

  4. Bocopro typed in:

    I’m not at all comfortable with small-town PDs or rural sheriff departments having heavy weapons such as tanks and sophisticated surveillance equipment.

    There may be a lot more Barney Fifes out there than we realize.

  5. Sparky says:

    I’m not anti cop or anything. We have a few friends that are of that persuasion. So feel kinda torn about how armed police should be. The most glaring thing I get from all this is that some of the cops shouldn’t be so heavily armed. There’s quite a bit of abuse going on. The heavy equipment should just be for if we’re invaded by an armed force (like the muslim “refugees”) and to protect us law abiding citizens.
    Happy Thanksgiving Z. Hope you and yours have a wonderful, relaxing day tomorrow! 🙂

  6. Bob says:

    “We’ve seen how militarized gear can sometimes give people a feeling like there’s an occupying force,” Oh, my! somebody might get a scary feeling over seeing an armored personnel carrier, like a couple of brothers from Elbonia-Stan who have been militarized Muslim style. The Feds are taking the equipment back because a personnel carrier “looks” like a tank?

    There are lots of bad cops, and even more good cops. It takes a special person to be a good cop, and holding one’s temper when confronted by shouting, threatening people is what I saw in the Fox coverage of the Chicago protests last night.

    In the case of LaQuant there is no way he should have been shot, but I don’t know all the facts. I really believe black people have been terribly mistreated because I was raised in the deep South in the 50’s and 60’s. I was witness to some cop attitudes towards black people.

    Of course, the same bad cops had bad attitudes towards everybody. It was a power trip.

  7. Bob says:

    bocopro said, “Not sure I want Bubba and Jethro having access to full-auto ARs or armored assault vehicles or sonic/infrared scanners, tho.”

    Look, every town and village needs an M1A1 Abrams to tear down Main Street for July 4th and other noteworthy holidays, like the opening of deer season. Besides, these people have been coddled by God, Mom, and shotgun toting Daddies all their lives, and probably carried heat into the classroom at the one room school to hunt for their lunch.

    Seriously, it’s those small town hicks that wind up in the US Army, defending us from the Tsarnaev brothers. I say let them have their fun as long as they pay for the gas, and patch their own streets. They already know about guns.

  8. alec says:

    Bocopro pretty much summed up my position as well. I’d just add this:

    1. It’s not a dualistic issue “pro-cop” vs. “anti-cop”, no matter how much the liars and manipulators want to make it that way.

    2. Police and military are needed to maintain civil order. There can be no reasonable life without both of these forces strong and working within proper legal limits.

    3. The key is that they are different groups. The military works outside of the domestic arena, except in the case of invasion. The police work domestically to protect citizens. When countries mix these two groups, the militarized police start looking at Old Joe as the enemy who just needs to be *taken out*.

  9. geeez2014 says:

    AOW, that’s ONE COP in that situation! With a guy who won’t put a knife down and I believe I heard he was high on something so his reactions might have been very threatening … I STILL don’t believe ANYBODY needs to be shot 16 times…
    But this IS ONE COP. And yes, it’s been ONE COP in areas around our country…I get that…and these cops must be STOPPED.
    Boy, if we ONLY concentrated on the really bad guys like our black community does looking for an instance to flip out over…..

    Jerry; I’m with you on this. Thanks to your dad for his service, because it can be really difficult service, particularly TODAY.

  10. America 1st, that has long been my belief, after WE are taken care of, after ALL Americans are fed, with a roof over their head, after OUR sick and wounded are cared for, after we have fixed all of the ills that we suffer, then perhaps we can extend a hand to help those that still hate our guts.
    It looks like the only policy he has is to kick the can down the road for the next year so the next President can deal with the consequences of Obama’s failures.
    But the democratic Moon Bats defended his foreign policy and reelected him!
    Oh well! I guess “black lives only matter” when Mr. Obama takes lead.
    Until then, let ’em hate us , who cares… It’s a sad day when a big majority of Americans (not all, of course) care more about transgender bathrooms and the Kardashians than Obama and this criminal Administration arming and fighting side by side with the terrorist ISIS.
    In ending, let me just say, I never believed that in my lifetime I would ever see the democrat party, the party of Truman, and Kennedy, become the Socialist, Marxist, Communist, party in the United States. Nor did I ever believe that there would be two, Socialists, and committed Marxists, running in that party, one a proven corrupt liar involved in scandals up to her ears and who appears guilty of criminal conduct in obstructing justice and running an influence-peddling racket. And the other who is just a idiot-looking and acting sham to make the first on look better. And who would think that the greatest threat in our lives today is Global Warming and “Black lives Matter”.
    I know that it’s depressing at times, but……
    HAPPY THANKSGIVING AMERICA! Be Safe America.

  11. geeez2014 says:

    Apparently, the president is building TRUST in the communities by taking away some of this more militaristic equipment from cops. The problem is that those tanks, etc., have worked.
    They make it sound like tanks are rolling through Main St like the Germans did down the Champs Elysee in WWII. This is crazy.

    Sparky; I get your point. But, if our towns don’t have the stuff, and we’re invaded by anybody, where do they suddenly get it from?
    There is an instance described in the article where a tank saved a lot of lives.

    Alec,. I get that …you make a good point….but I still am so tired of hearing our own cops weakened. I also honestly believe the people at the top, who do feel this stuff is necessary, aren’t crazies who want to play around. They’d be the first to say if this equipment was superfluous.

    Everybody; don’t forget this isn’t a LOT of equipment…it’s specialized for certain situations…and has helped.

    Bob…I don’t know personally about the South but I get that. I also saw the stare-down that one guy covered by FOX was giving to a white cop…staring, staring, right into the cop’s eyes. I don’t know how good cops can stand taking the heat for that of the few really bad ones.

    I think it’s troubling there’s so little trust in our police even here at GeeeZ/ I get it, I know particularly this latest killing is a TERRIBLE overabuse of a cop’s power, but it seems to me that while so many are pushing our cops to the limit of their patience, and terrorism is on the rise, this is a time to support law enforcement.
    The request for this equipment isn’t from the cop on the beat; it’s from the experts .

  12. John M. Berger says:

    I just have a couple of questions:
    1) At what point of disruption should local law enforcement cede authority to the National Guard ?
    2) How much longer can we expect existing and potential “good cops” to remain in or be attracted to what appears to be an increasingly thankless profession?

  13. Silverfiddle says:

    The militarization of our police forces has gotten out of hand. I hate to sound like a leftist, but they’ve come to resemble an army of occupation is many cases.

    In narrow circumstances, some of that armor and hardware is warranted, but often, it’s just posing.

    I think our society has outstripped our modes and concepts of policing.

  14. Silverfiddle says:

    Also, I am pro-cop. It is an unfortunate reality that even a smaller city like where I live would be anarchic chaos without the thin blue line.

  15. Bob says:

    @Alec, “When countries mix these two groups, the militarized police start looking at Old Joe as the enemy who just needs to be *taken out*.”

    Point taken. We don’t need no national police force around here.

  16. Bob says:

    @John ” At what point of disruption should local law enforcement cede authority to the National Guard ?”

    I favor our present system. The state governors have that discretion. The latest and saddest examples are Ferguson, MO, where the guv called out the guard, and then would not let them protect the citizenry. Another bad example was former Governor of Louisiana Kathleen Blanco when she did not call out the state guard for Katrina until it was too late for them to do anything.

  17. Mustang says:
    I am not pro-Cop. I am pro-American. To the extent that we require law enforcement officers to guarantee the peace and security of our communities, I support the police and sheriff’s departments. I do not wish to live in a police state a la Oceania in 1984, however. I do not want to see American peace officers carrying machineguns in the manner of Russian state security, the Schutzstaffel, or Saddam Hussein’s Republican Guard. I think the militarization of civilian police began after the North Hollywood shootout. Tracked vehicles with local police markings may be an over-reaction. In 2012, NYPD officers responded to a shooting near the Empire State Building; nine innocent bystanders were wounded by police bullets.
  18. geeez2014 says:

    JMB; excellent questions. I hope more people respond..Bob has some good answers

    Bob, the Katrina mistake was good for the left who STILL say Bush was supposed to charge into that when we were reminded it’s the STATE that calls for help. So, at least this mistake on her part helped the Leftwingers to this day….

    No, no national police force, that is FOR SURE.

    Silverfiddle; I agree about the traditional modes of policing; it seems like I hear stories of when cops actually walk the beats and get to know people they get more information, they develop relationships and people actually like them, they get a feel. for the needs of the community, they benefit in GREAT ways, so their community does, too.

    Mustang; I think the important point is that our cops are being pushed to the limit, good and bad cops are totally disrespected by many Blacks and the news..
    This article may be a leap most of us don’t want to make, but there is a lot of proof that some of this stuff does work. Nobody likes seeing cops with anything like you described and, so far, it’s not happened on any grand scale.
    SO, pushed to the limit; Terrorism on the RISE, and our cops are , if anything, having their hands tied even MORE.
    I know many are yokels, let’s face it, they’re not always the cream of the crop in any way imaginable, but they need better training, MUCH better training, and they need to know we have their back.

  19. Baysider says:

    “We’ve seen how militarized gear can sometimes give people a feeling like there’s an occupying force” – a rare truth spoken by Obama. I agree. It ‘looks’ bad. A more relevant issue is behavior and tactics. We had 17 cops respond to a potential burglary in progress in my town with 3 principals. The woman had locked herself out of her apt. and had a locksmith let her in late at night. She had identification for her address and a locksmith’s receipt on her. Yet when you send 17 guys and dogs things can balloon way fast. Gads! We had a suspect in a headlock at our house 20 years ago and only got one cop! Things have changed.

    So, what do they do with all that tactical gear? Use it! Maybe some guys just have to show off, but it’s very bad when you make the PDs an extension of the army with gear AND tactics that have a different purpose. You demonstrate an us-vs-them attitude. It DOES make PDs look like occupation forces. Think: Boston in the hunt for the bombers.

    A lot of this becomes just a show of force to control. We’ve read the stories of ordinary folks like us not allowed back inside a HUGE perimeter of many neighborhoods just to go home – sleeping in their cars on a bridge and running out of essential meds because of a**hole attitudes by cops chasing a guy in the distant woods.

    Swat teams form up way to often for virtually CIVIL matters. Yes – I’ve seen it in my own neighborhood. I don’t blame police for being edgy about the explosion that may be lurking behind some smug creep’s attitude. I remember the sheriff who was pistol whipped unconscious with his own gun this summer. He hesitated because he didn’t want to be the next news items of white cop shoots “unarmed black man” syndrome. But on the other hand, when you have goons blowing apart some innocent guy’s house because they are in hot pursuit of a bad guy who holed up there, we have a major attitude problem on using force. And the weapons to do it.

    I used to be more pro cop. I had a friend in the upper echelons of LAPD and saw their view. 40 long years ago, and their view was WAY different than it appears to be now.

    All this to agree with Mustang in a lot more words.

  20. -FJ says:

    All we need now is more zero tolerance school policies to go along with stricter policing.

  21. geeez2014 says:

    Baysider; You sound a bit like “we can’t have collateral damage, God forbid” as we are warned in our fight against ISIS..when ISIS’s goal is collateral damage. Yes, to protect the larger community, perfection will never be possible..ever. Homes will get shot up, innocent people could die, too many cops are sent out because of a mistake in the call for help….

    We will never have anything near perfection, but isn’t it strange that, until recently, things were pretty good?

    I’ll always err on the side of the cops, though I’ve met some who are bastards. What you would say the LAPD’s “friend in the upper echelons” might say their view is now, as you suggest…?

    FJ…yikes! This is why better training and communications are necessary!!

    Does anybody here think cops are the ONLY profession that must be perfect all the time?

  22. geeez2014 says:

    By the way, friends; Has anybody seen any protest or any threatening of Black people after 3 young Black men apparently raped and killed the pregnant mother married to the young pastor?

  23. geeez2014 says:

    I’ve been thinking of what I said above, and I believe I’m right about most of it. I hope so, anyway. ..for the good of our country. But the question that creeps into my mind a lot these days is this:

    We are a different people today. Most of us, at the age of most of my readers, are still people of good values, who know shame, who aren’t thieves, who’d not hurt people on purpose.
    What we have to realize is WE LIVE IN A VERY DIFFERENT WORLD TODAY.

    People take jobs because of the pay more than any fulfillment in the work. In my experience, there are a lot of pretty taciturn ‘servers’ in this country…and I’m someone who almost always helps a waitress or check out clerk to smile….still, I see a feeling that nobody does their job really to SERVE anymore…to have fun doing it.,,,to help the diner enjoy the experience more. SOME do, no doubt about that, but it’s rarer and rarer.

    For example; we judge teenagers for their promiscuity when, really, they LITERALLY don’t know better. Everything in their world points to the joys of unwed mothers, sex that’s treated like “pass the potatoes”, drugs are cool, you’re a freak without tattoos, school is nonsense, teachers are to be disdained…. etc etc. We have to face this.

    And I believe policing is very little different these days. Gone are the days of the good ol’ Irish Mic (even that’s racist to say today, right?) walking the streets, waving at the butcher, helping the little girl with her skates……..that’s largely over, though I know I and most of us DO hear great stories about cops.

    The sad and bad is winning out……..
    QUESTION: Can we expect ANy profession to escape my sad scenarios? Can we expect cops to be the only ones who do? Except they have WEAPONS in their hands….which makes any taciturn moment, or WORSE, MUCH WORSE, DANGEROUS.
    SO, we notice more when they’re off that day or dead tired, or worried they won’t make it home alive.

    Just sayin’. How do we solve THAT? 🙂

  24. alec says:

    Z’s comment is a ray of light on this whole contrived mess which we call policing in 2015 USA:

    I agree about the traditional modes of policing; it seems like I hear stories of when cops actually walk the beats and get to know people they get more information, they develop relationships and people actually like them, they get a feel. for the needs of the community, they benefit in GREAT ways, so their community does, too.

    And just why exactly has this kind of policing been forcibly eliminated from cities across America? Why do police commissioners reject citizen pleas to bring it back? Who loses when the police are fully integrated with the people in their communities? It’s not you and I.

    These are the kinds of questions which can get us to the heart of the matter. Unfortunately, we do have a federal controlled and directed police force in the USA. Not that any of us were asked about it.

  25. geeez2014 says:

    Hi, thanks, Alec….I think I heard that some neighborhoods had implemented this ‘on the beat’ thing again and it had worked well…. But we sure don’t see that much, do we. Particularly today, when cops have to be scared to death of being killed…cops with a wife and four little ones at home! I think we forget that they have lives, too. So, for them to walk around is probably frightening.

    NOW, when our country probably should be on high alert but isn’t because the enemy doesn’t seem to be considered too dangerous by our administration, is not the time to be degrading or disarming law enforcement. The Black situation having come to (hopefully) a head in Baltimore and Ferguson, has REALLY soured everything and cops are back on the chopping block again….and doubted and condemned and mocked when we will probably need them the most.
    Then we have those on the very far right who think this is all planned in order to get the police federalized and militarized against US…geeeZ

    Why do you think commissioners reject the please for more personal policing?

  26. alec says:

    Why do you think commissioners reject the please for more personal policing?

    On one level they have been trained to equate “statistics” with “efficiency” and “doing a good job”. Unfortunately the first two have nothing to do with the third. But they will never listen to you, because they trust their degrees more.

    The big city commissioners must be politicians. And so they obey the real behind the scenes power brokers.

    has REALLY soured everything and cops are back on the chopping block again….and doubted and condemned and mocked when we will probably need them the most.

    My cynical assessment is that this is the real goal of someone – chaos and further slow degradation of the system. We should pray for the good men in the police.

  27. geeez2014 says:

    Alec “We should pray for the good men in the police.”

    That’s a big enough ‘topic’ for a whole new blog post all on its own…that subject…just praying for the good men in the police. Amen to that. Thanks for the reminder. We should pray every day for them and their families, who must be scared witless over the attacks on innocent cops just sitting in their cars.

  28. geeez2014 says:

    BY THE WAY:

    They’re saying Airport guards are on HIGH SECURITY and we all know suicide bombers want to die in the attack, so how’s a guard dog or HIGH SECURITY really HELP? All the guy or burkha has to do is pull the string if surrounded, yes?

  29. Kid says:

    Agree Bocopro and Mustang mainly.

  30. geeez2014 says:

    Kid, I just don’t see it…. This article doesn’t suggest huge numbers of any military types of equipment…just enough that they need. And they show it’s been needed.
    I’d rather our cops and our communities are safe rather than the perps. And I’m sure you and Boco and Mustang would agree with that.

  31. geeez2014 says:

    You know, I’ve been thinking, and I still hold my opinions about this, BUT I think what REALLY bothers me, and should bother us all, is that so many don’t trust law enforcement anymore…at a time we might need them more than ever.
    I cling to the belief that they deserve protection themselves, that they need the best of what we’ve got to protect US in these awful times with terror and black lives matter, etc.

    WHY IS THIS SUDDEN MISTRUST PREVALENT?

    Is it only since Obama we started even thinking our police could turn against us? Or is it that weird WorldNetDaily stuff of empty coffins and threats that he’s going to get us? Or how our gov’t is buying so much ammo our soldiers don’t have enough? Or what?

    We ALL know there have been bad cops, but why this REAL fear of them, this kind of pervading awful distrust ? I think that’s new…

  32. Mustang says:

    Z … I don’t see mistrust as something recent. The Second Amendment has been around for a few hundred years now.

  33. geeez2014 says:

    So you think this awful mistrust and even hate toward police has been around since the 2nd Amendment? I mean specifically toward police today; this hate and suspicion isn’t something I felt growing up, that’s for sure. And, trust me, I’m younger than that Amendment (believe it or not!)

  34. Baysider says:

    You’re right – we don’t trust law enforcement any more as an entity. It’s not sudden – it’s the militarization of local agencies that builds lack of trust. Both equipment and tactics. And Obama’s push to nationalize a police force – which he promised publicly early in office.

    My comments had nothing to do with ‘no collateral damage.’ They are directed at the knee-jerk bullying tactics that are openly suffusing law enforcement once again. A few stray bullet holes is not what I had in mind. It’s a police agency WILLFULLY punching caving in the sides of your home with a battering ram because they want to ‘show force’ to a criminal who ran in to take refuge. Now YOU have a home whose structural integrity is ruined – and a $100,000 repair bill. Oops. All because some cowboy couldn’t keep his testosterone under control.

    The examples I mentioned are a pattern of activity emerging that should scare the beejesus out of honest citizens. Like the ‘freeze in place’ drills at airports. These are not tactics to scare or nab criminals, but to cow a population into submission to big brother. You ever hear of the Israelis doing an airport drill like that? No! They carry out covert and more effective security measures because they aren’t afraid to profile.

    Which gets me back to JMB’s question. I think we’re getting a lot of this because of the uproar over profiling. It’s a natural and instinctive way a good, experienced cop can judge something that smells bad. This kind of change will drive good men out.

  35. geeez2014 says:

    Baysider, but it is very recent….and it’s this gov’t who’s taking away the supposed militarized equipment, not enhancing it for cops, etc. So, in this case, it’s not feds we should be fearful of.

    This mistrust of the police is more virulent, more palpable now, sadly.

    My comparison to collateral damage is an important one; we can’t expect perfection, or even close, in policing l…it’s the nature of the business that unintended bad things will happen. Really bad things. Houses shot up, even people killed by accident, or in the line of fire. It happens. And it will never stop as long as cops are trying to protect communities and bullets are flying .

    I’ve personally never heard of ‘freeze in place’ anywhere and I’ve done a heck of a lot of airplane travel. Is this something new?
    Israelis can be more covert, we can’t because of our government and its outrageous fear of political correctness.

    I suppose I live at least as active and aware a life as most and I’ve seen houses rammed very rarely in the news….

    Is anyone here surmising from what I’m saying that I agree with any strong arm, illegal or unnecessarily strong tactics of the police?
    All I’m saying is we need better training for them so they can be more effective and they need the equipment their leadership says they need. And that this attitude of mistrust is dangerous for everyone but the bad guys.

  36. Kid says:

    Z, “I’d rather our cops and our communities are safe rather than the perps.”
    – Agree wiht the caveat that SWAT vehicles Are armored. That’s all the cops need. If they need more than that then you call in the Natl Guard.

    To your comment about mistrust, I see it this way. This country has a much larger percentage of vermin in it and they continue to grow in numbers. During the couple times I’ve been stopped by the cops, (last one about 5 yrs ago), I was impressed by how calmly they walk up to my window and start talking. I’ve had good interactions with the cops thus far. I envision myself as a cop stopping “unknown individual” on the highway, and I think I might be a bit more cautious than the guys who I’ve interacted with. The again, I could be wrong. The plate gives them my name which doesn’t happen to be Keyshawn or Achmed, so with experience and data, cops likely get to know the problem areas (Which I’m not in), and the other signs that might indicate there could be trouble or not. (No wants no warrants on Kid) Most losers generally aren’t driving clean well maintained vehicles and usually have a history.

    Frankly, I wouldn’t mind running into a bad cop as long as I survive. Law suit. $$$. Retirement handled.

  37. Kid says:

    Regards Mustangs comment on 2nd Amendment – This is the main reason I don’t want cops with military equipment. With cop cars, and the one or two SWAT vehicles, I think cops would be very hesitent to go driving house to house trying to confiscate weapons should our highly questionable government and majority (so far) voting base decide we should all be disarmed.

    Pull up in an MRAP with 50 caliber machine gun barrels sticking out the side and I’m not going to be fighting back.

  38. geeez2014 says:

    Kid “That’s all the cops need. If they need more than that then you call in the Natl Guard.”

    And, I didn’t see anything in the equipment taken from the cops in this article that was so much worse than that…maybe I’m wrong. It was also refreshing to see it was the feds taking the stuff away; considering so many on the Right seem to think Obama wants us in those maple coffins we get emails about coming from World Net (gag) Daily!

    I’m not sure what you mean about cops driving around confiscating weapons….
    but you’re right about one bad cop and your retirement handled!

    The MILLIONS they gave Freddie Gray’s parents blew my mind….they’d pretty much ignored this guy all his life/ dad wasn’t at home, mom thinks so much of her son she spends the days in her crack haze, and now she’s got PLENTY with which to buy her crack. Dad only got one mill, I think she got six million!

  39. Kid says:

    Z, “I’m not sure what you mean about cops driving around confiscating weapons….”

    While I’d agree the concept seems extreme, obama and crew have been doing more extreme things by the day. Caution is warranted.

    We’ve got to shut these baby factories down. LBJ’s dream, democrat voter Nirvanna, Instant Vermin Karma, Let’s get some Schwarma…..and a Vodka Martini, shaken, not stirred.

  40. Baysider says:

    Z, we’re going to disagree. Bulldozing a house to squish a cockroach is not collateral damage. It is not imperfection. I can hardly even call it POOR POLICING. We had a guy duck behind ours with the police in pursuit. Mr. B was instrumental in his capture. What if we were gone? And he came into our shed? And I came home to find my building with holes all punched through it? THAT is the ‘collateral damage’ I’m talking about without even getting into bullying SWAT raids where there is NO expectation of armed defense. I’ve seen that. It’s just bullying.

    You’re right about training. We have to remember this work attracts bullies and people who have the inner stuff to be able to do extreme harm to others (a trait shared by surgeons and violent felons – so yeah, how it’s directed matters). For years there was an effort to professionalize police work and keep the bullies out. I got my master’s degree in a program full of cops! I’ve known quite a number of fine men in that profession.

    Now, though, we see the bullying being institutionalized. I find that very worrisome.

    As for feds, my brother had a friend in the feds years ago who told him if he encountered a problem (say something one might want to go to a well-known federal agency that even had its own TV show once) that you should not do that. Go instead to the most local police agency. I don’t think the feds like having ‘locals’ impinge on any turf the feds want. Instead of fighting them, they’ve decided to roll them into the federal sphere. Money talks. Making some guys ‘feel big’ works, too. At least it looks that way.

    Here’s one story on airport ‘obedience’ drills.

  41. Kid says:

    Baysider – Disgusting. Same as the ‘shelter in place’ things for an entire city like Boston. What???? People die all the time. Shut down a city for an indefinite period because of one POS moslem vermin. Totally unacceptable. Totally Un-American. Totally – Un-Civilization.

    DHS and TSA need to go. And not because they are totally incompetent and useless.

  42. geeez2014 says:

    yes, we definitely disagree. I don’t discount what you’re saying… I believe all of it, obviously, you’re not making this up. I just don’t think most , or even a lot, of cops are anywhere near to what you’re describing.
    Not sure about “Freeze”…did it happen once? Was it a test to try something out in case there was someone they needed to stop?
    Maybe I need to be much more cynical. I hope not.

    Kid, tell me how you’d make sure nothing gets on a plane without some kind of safeguard…get rid of TSA and do what? Privatize?

    We’re cooked, anyway, because we have people who aren’t properly vetted (there IS no way to really properly vet) who work FOR the caterers and the ticket agents and TSA….
    What are your ideas about protecting us….??

  43. Kid says:

    Z, All I can tell you8 is this: Testers regularly get guns, hand grenades, expolsives and other weapons past TSA all the time as of today. They’re incompetent. They’re useless. All they do is serve to hassle American citizens. TSA was/is a jobs program.

    Pasengers have demonstrated that they will not allow vermin to take over a plane. Remember on 9-11-2001, the standard operating procedure was to allow hijackers to take over a plane, because it was standard operating procedure for the vermin to re-route the plane somwwhere. That’s out the window now. Cockpits are sealed, Passengers will not put up with a bunch of vermin trying to take over a plane. They will overcome them and put the down. Unless it’s 85% vermin to 15% good guys, but I don’t see that happening. Passengers reject even having a few vermin on a plane these days. Just a couple days ago, a plane flight was aborted because there were 6 moslem vermin jacking around pre-flight. I’ve even seen flights aborted because of one moslem vermin getting animated.

    So, now all you have to do is keep explosives off the plane. That can be easily done in baggage handling. England has been doing it for decades and without hassling their passengers. Leave your luggage unattended in the airport for a few minutes, they collect it, take it to a bin and blow it up. Any passengers luggage on a plane without passenger is taken out and blown up. Ok, we have suicidal moslem passengers now. We should be able to screen for explosive material in carry on’s and other. We have to do THAT anyway since suicidal vermin can get on to planes right now using today’s procedures.

    Summary: scan for explosives. Don’t worry about moslem vermin with toenail clippers (or mirror shards form the restroom) because the passengers and the impenatrable cockpit dorrs will take care of that problem. Delete the TSA. Delete the DHS. Our intelligence services abhor the DHS, who since it was created has been run by incompetents – especially under obama. It’s a useless administrative layer that is counter productive.

  44. geeez2014 says:

    Kid, thanks….I guess the bottom line is : DO LIKE ISRAEL DOES. That SURE does seem to work.
    I totally agree with you about DHS, but I do think we need SOMETHING to oversee safety in America. Maybe I’m wrong…just seems like it’s a totally new ballgame today and we can’t be playing with the same bats we’ve always used, right?

    And yes, suicidal maniacs are WAY out of our league; What kind of NUT………? And they have to be dealt with.

  45. geeez2014 says:

    http://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/national/article46593080.html

    Ya, that’s the ticket, right? Stop any economic benefits to Chicago because a cop killed a kid. That makes a lot of sense. What a HORRID thing to do…I hope this puts a REALLY sour taste in the mouths of shop owners AND shoppers….

    Such a shame they don’t do something about black on black crime…so many needless murders of black kids done by black kids and they’re quiet……..no protest, no nothing.
    disguusting.

  46. alec says:

    Baysider, have never heard of “freeze in place”, but agree with your and Kid’s assessment.

    It’s hard for all of us to really accept that Homeland Security and the TSA are not what they are presented to be.

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