Nationalism….”Skinhead?” (naaaaaaaa)

  1. (From Merriam-Webster) 1:  loyalty and devotion to a nation; especially :  a sense of national consciousness  exalting one nation above all others and placing primary emphasis on promotion of its culture and interests as opposed to those of other nations or supranational groups.

  2.  (from Wikipedia) Nationalism is a complex, multidimensional concept involving a shared communal identification with one’s nation. It is a political ideology oriented towards gaining and maintaining self-governance, or full sovereignty, over a territory of historical significance to the group (such as its homeland). Nationalism therefore holds that a nation should govern itself, free from unwanted outside interference, and is linked to the concept of self-determination. Nationalism is further oriented towards developing and maintaining a national identity based on shared characteristics such as culture, language, race, religion, political goals or a belief in a common ancestry.  Nationalism therefore seeks to preserve the nation’s culture. It often also involves a sense of pride in the nation’s achievements, and is closely linked to the concept of patriotism. In these terms, nationalism can be considered positive or negative.

So….”positive or negative”?….what’s negative?…patriotism?  self-determination?  unwanted outside interference?  historical significance?  preserving a culture?  pride in achievements?  Which do you think Wikipedia finds negative?   

   REALLY??   REALLY?

Put the word NATIONALISM away then if it’s somehow sprouted meanings that are reminiscent of prewar Germany, and let’s talk using the definitions above….

What’s WRONG with true NATIONALISM as defined?   Trump’s being labeled as someone who believes strongly in nationalism, and the inference is that he is xenophobic, racist, jingoistic and other unlikable traits.

Are you a nationalist?  Why?  Why not?  Can’t legal immigrants fit into this nationalism?  My mother SURE DOES 🙂   Her house at any American holiday makes the old holiday specials like Andy Williams and the King Sisters look under decorated!

What’s WRONG WITH IT?   Is LEGAL immigration xenophobic?  Is keeping us safe racist?  Thoughts?

Z

Advertisements
This entry was posted in America, matters of interest, Patriotism, Trump, Z family. Bookmark the permalink.

25 Responses to Nationalism….”Skinhead?” (naaaaaaaa)

  1. There’s certainly nothing wrong with the definition given here. I consider myself very much a nationalist in that sense. Where it goes astray, is how some people define the term within their own framing, to mean only a homogeneous group, with regards to race, religion. Nationalism has been used to excuse invasion and genocide in the past.

    It’s just another term that has been misused over the years…much like ‘Liberal’ didn’t used to mean Leftist.

  2. bocopro says:

    Just as with friendship, you can love a spouse or a child while still being pleasant to other married people and children. That’s akin to patriotism. Nationalism, however, often demands superiority over other nations, other cultures, and involves more contempt and scorn for others.

    For nearly a quarter century of my adult life my full-time employment was patriotic duty to flag and country. But in those 24 years I saw dozens of other countries, other cultures, and realized that most of their citizens felt much the same about their country as I did about mine. And I didn’t dislike or suspect them for that belief.

    And like friends, sometimes people have screwy or dangerous ideas, and sometimes they don’t meet your personal criteria for friendship. Same with nations. The problem comes in when you decide that YOUR nation, YOUR culture, has some kind of divine mandate to rule over others.

    My grandmother once said (on a different subject) that had I been born in China, I’d very likely speak Chinese, and had I been born in India, I’d probably be a Hindu. She was making the point that people are people no matter where they’re born, and it’s governments run by autocratic megalomaniacs that tend to cause the trouble.

    That was during the time of Hitler and Mussolini and Stalin, of course, and she was absolutely right. My grandfather, when asked by one of my uncles during that dinnertime discussion what he felt about nationalism, said, “You have to play the cards you’re dealt.” What he meant was that your dance with who ya brung.

    Another way of putting it is that you gotta stand for somethin or you’ll fall for anything. Doesn’t mean you can’t have dinner with your neighbors or that the loser in a sporting event has to die. Very wise old birds who raised me.

    People who break into your house, live in your basement, eat your food, and drive up your utility bills are NOT your houseguests; they are squatters, parasites, and criminals. Islam is completely incompatible with our culture, our laws, our traditions. Most Muslims are moderates, meaning they don’t want to rape your women and cut your head off – they want the RADICAL Muslims to do it.

    Immigration is fine, so long as the immigrants are disease free, bring skills, are willing to work for their upkeep, learn English, and respect our laws and customs. Otherwise, if you’re coming here to transform this place into the pesthole from which you say you’re escaping because of oppression, stay home.

  3. Kid says:

    The Declaration of Independence defines America as what could be the greatest country on Earth. It is for some of us.

  4. geeez2014 says:

    And my point is that, by those definitions, we still seem to be told no nationalism is good….I think it’s nuts to continue to view nationalism, patriotism, etc., as wrong and scary and I’m tired of hearing Trump and others excoriated for sounding like they are for nationalism. I AM.

    Anything can be carried too far….but we don’t write most things off because of the extremes…

    Bocopro…”Nationalism, however, often demands superiority over other nations, other cultures, and involves more contempt and scorn for others.”
    I do believe our nation is superior and our culture is every bit as good as all other cultures….not sure anybody I know has contempt or scorn for any other unless they’re dangerous, threatening, or haven’t really done much at all to improve themselves or the world.

  5. geeez2014 says:

    A report on FOX this morning showed VA after VA with no pics of Trump and Pence…Obama and Biden have been taken down and this admin isn’t put up because “he’s not our president,” and “he’s going to be impeached, anyway” Those were the 2 main reasons.

    Gee, I guess people just hate it when we put America first…not caring to listen to the facts, just reacting to things like NATIONALISM, PATRIOTISM, TRYING HARD TO KEEP US SAFE………

  6. bocopro says:

    All boils down to a coupla things:

    1. The Leftistas got their knickers all in a wad because they lost the election and didn’t even get a participation trophy.

    2. The relentless tidal wave of PC has swept over both coasts, bringing mass hysteria and panic in the forms of bacterial Islamophilia and contagious Open Borderitis.

    3. The Political partisanship virus has mutated into the dreaded Spite Fever which manifests itself in age regression to the terrible twos and Tantrumonia.

  7. Nationalism based on race or “fatherland” (same thing) is reasonable for cultural integrity but nationalism based on ideals as embodied in the Declaration and Constitution leaves nothing to be denigrated.
    No one who agrees with those principles, regardless of race, religion, etc, would suffer under that concept.

  8. Mal says:

    Its hard to add to what C.I. and Bocopro said and pretty much covers it.
    Bocopro’s last paragraph about “immigration is fine, so long as the immigrants are disease free, bring skills, are willing to work for their upkeep, learn English, and respect our laws and customs” is exactly what it USE to be, and was when my father came through Ellis Island 102 years ago. So what the heck happened?
    As a nation, we accept and even encourage “change”, but we need to make an exception when it comes to our Constitution and our values. Those kind of things should never change, but it has, and therein lies our problem.

  9. -FJ says:

    I’m an economic nationalist, but not a mercantilist. I want the government’s involvement in global trade to stop at the imposition of import tariffs to protect American manufacturing and export sanctions to prevent the dissemination of American technologies.

  10. Imp says:

    Nationalism. It’s clear there are far superior cultures. Ones that are proud of their country, their languages, their borders. It’s just as clear that Islime is a retrograde, political ideology that hasn’t produced one functioning, productive society any where it exists. Trump understood that…that’s why he was elected. La Pen understands that…Wilders understands that….the Poles do…the Hungarians do and we’re seeing a resurrection of that type of populism ands pride throughout, advanced western societies. And we’re not all the same either in our animal kingdom. There’s plenty of proof with the amount of failed “countries” to look at.

  11. geeez2014 says:

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-may-have-discussed-classified-info-on-fox-news-top-dem-on-house-intel-panel-charges-192902034.html

    This is what happens when someone doesn’t really understand politics, intelligence, secrets, etc. Obviously, the very biased writing in the article is bad but we can’t keep saying “the writer is biased!” when the actual story is BAD. Trump jumped in fast and needs a few lessons in intel and keeping his mouth shut.

    I think people are right….that he’ll have impeachment suits on him within 3 months…maybe 6.

  12. Z – This is what’s killing me….he doesn’t have to say a word….he has the investigatory power of every federal law enforcement agency at his disposal.

  13. Imp says:

    CI…I believe he wants to keep the average citizen and his base in the loop?

  14. Kid says:

    Z, compared to hilrod? Pfffft. Another nothing burger.

  15. I don’t consider levelling a specific, criminal charge against the previous POTUS, based solely on an article from an outlet that he publicly considers to be “fake news”……. as keeping the public in the loop (not to mention potential spillage of classified information).

    I consider it either mental instability or trolling his own supporters.

  16. geeez2014 says:

    Imp….keeping in loop? Information that’s not verifiable, certain, definitive? i want to be kept in the fact loop myself.

    CI is right…unless Trump’s pulling something SO big and brilliant on the media and whoever else he thinks (knows?, hopefully?) is wrong and he can soon prove it and make them all look terrible, he seems unstable at this point.

    I know many of you don’t give a rip about leftwing news, etc, but I am still of the school that you want to know what people are hearing…put on CNN any minute of any day and watch them smugly laughing, and deservedly so! A panel sits there discussing this stuff when I put it on every once in a while, and they can’t hold back the giggles…”so, wait! what evidence IS there that anybody wiretapped?” *giggle giggle* Ugh. It’s very disheartening and, some of you think that’s all they’re doing…trying to dishearten America against Trump…but REALLY? How can ANY president give THIS much ammunition?

  17. geeez2014 says:

    Kid…ya, it’s NOT HILLARY and we ALL are grateful for this….but I don’t think a lot of us signed up for THIS stuff. EVERY SINGLE FREAKIN’ THING SEEMS TO BE GOING WRONG.
    This newest accusation of having leaked intel is bad…one doesn’t hear that about sitting presidents very often.

  18. ..it’s NOT HILLARY and we ALL are grateful for this…

    Amen to that…..but we should still demand standards worthy of Conservatism.

  19. geeez2014 says:

    BY THE WAY…..I recognize I sound like a Trump hater and I AM NOT. I WANT HIM TO SUCCEED WITH THE PROMISES HE MADE TO ALL OF US AND I TRULY BELIEVE HE LOVES AMERICA AND WOULD LIKE TO PROTECT US, IF HE’S ALLOWED TO, AND TO BUILD OUR ECONOMY, WHICH I THINK WILL HAPPEN.
    I TOTALLY BELIEVE HE UNDERSTANDS AMERICA’S TRUE GOODNESS AND THE IDEOLOGY OF OUR FOUNDING FATHERS FAR, FAR BETTER THAN ANYBODY ON THE LEFT, AND RESPECTS IT….A VERY GOOD THING.

    Maybe I shouldn’t type my criticisms here because it’s unpleasant; maybe it’s a way for me to ‘vent’ but it’s my blog and I appreciate the back/forth with you guys.

    Thanks.

  20. geeez2014 says:

    WOW…liberal Leon Podesta is complimenting Trump and Mattis on the more boots on the ground in the M.E. and what they’re seeming to start doing in Korea…

  21. Kid says:

    Z, Not to worry. The folks that came out for Trump will do so again IF he gets the job done, regardless of how “unpresidential” the process may be. In fact, I think many are enjoying the “unpresidential” nature of Trump from what I glean from Right leaning website comment sections. The Un-PC.

    Here’s one:
    obama played the race card,
    clinton played the woman card,
    we played the Trump card.
    🙂

  22. geeez2014 says:

    Kid…I agree….with exception to the ‘unpresidential nature”….I thought tweeting stupid stuff was unpresidential; leaking intel is more than just unpresidential, if that’s true….
    I like your card analogy.

    I’m sick of this EVERY SINGLE FREAKIN’ DAY……….please, Mr. Trump; do a repeat of that great Congressional speech…..PLEASE…every day, do something admirable. I’d like that.

  23. Kid says:

    Z, fwiw, I’m 100% with you on not talking about being wiretapped until you can prove it. That’s so stupid I wouldn’t even do it. But then he wsays within a couple weeks he will present… Hmm. Still I wouldn’t do it without being able to stuff it the next day or within a couple days.

    Otherwise We.Don’t.Care. We like non-politician.

    Again, all he needs to do is get the job done, and frankly he ain’t getting it done with health care. Not many on board for obammycare lite – And with no tort reform. That’s the big one. Just how powerful is the lawyer lobby?

  24. Baysider says:

    CI + 1.

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s